Hi My Mate D4E,

I have been watching your progress, and lack of it for as long as you began posting.....yet it was just a hint from another message from you that told me all was not well.
We can hide behind our sense of humour, yet it only covers the pain. As spoken by somone and I recall "When the laughter is over the pain remains."

It is indeed a gut renching feeling and no kidding at all, I know it too well, and it ain't a friend. Post traumatic nerves, but who neds a name it is aweful. I sorrow wth you in the way you are treated, and I wouldn't doubt that her solicitor is too proud to let you see the freedom of it passed as yet. If I am in error in thinking this way, it comes from knowing human nature of some too well.

I send you encouragement and a hand of friendship. You know I care....you have been there for me...and I , and others for you good Buddy.

Try to listen to music, and not alow the record to play in your mind.
I am thinking much of you and will speak with him who knows anyway.

My enriching regards Mate

Col ..............you need not reply to this. I have it already.

Hey Col

Yes you are right there is suffering involved because of medical conditions and such, and when I get the letter from the lawyer it knocks the crap out of me, even more so if there has been other things in life that effect where I'm at before the communications come.

I have now got it down pat to send my responses so I recieve their responses when my daughter is not with me, if it comes earlier I have a quick read then hide it till she goes back to her mums.

But as I have preached before " it does get easier and quicker to recover from "

This added with waiting before I post until I can look through the fair ground mirror of irony and truely see the funny side, which there alway's is.

In this I can be my own worse enemy because in reality I am assisting the lawyer playing his games, all I have to do is let my X be as irresponsible as ever and reject reality in the way she always does. This of course would mean me once again taking on costs and filling necessary documents.

This time around I was suffering and it caught me off guard so I'm pretty drained and raw, this is true but I'm still here ready to go the distance if called upon.

Although there is no more emotional pain associated with my daughters mother and hasn't been for some time, there will always be a pain associated with her because I know my daughter has, is and will suffer because her mother only has one person she needs to take care of and everyone else is simply there as a tool to achieve more attension.

What my X's lawyer is infering will effect our daughter and even though I doubt he would be able to establish his threat my daughters mother who refuses to mediate and discuss is forcing the issues.

So the pain is physical as well as mental with disapointment attached to it, all's normal in other words

Thanks for your kind words and support and although I know I needent respond, it does answer the question in case others have the same feelings and problems

Just a quick short update.

I expect this all to be finalised very shortly the last few weeks have been a bit rough and I've had to bite the bullet a few more times just to move forward.
I'm learning more now it's comming to an end than perhaps I have before this point and sometimes knowing that you are right and can do somthing about it is enough of a victory and you end up making the sacrifices with pride that you have not sunk to the level of the opposition, in my case my child incubator.

I talked to a lawyer finaly after near three years of battling their parrasitic nature, just to give me the last bit of advice as to where I stood in regard to orders. We did not hit it off well, he was typical of the Family Law tribe who few things in an outdated maner that does not fir into todays society and does not look to the rights of the father to maintain the same quality of life for their children as a mother is garanteed.

This opinion I did not ask for nor was I interested in I only attended for one reason and that was to clarify the definition on the consent orders, once we made it to that and I allowed him to digest what he was reading and then supplying him with the letters from the parasite and my reply to them, we got down to business. As I expected I was right and I could lodge a contravention application with expectations of being sucessfull.

I have been running a gauntlet and calling the bluff of having a contravention application lodged against me and being threatend with claims for costs on her part to being able to say " Do it " This was enough for me to simply pay the few hundred dollars remaining blood money and provide security for my daughter.

Even if it does go pear shaped I now have presentable evidence because of the way I have kept on top of everything and because I have used others knowladge to help me through the burdens, their opinions and there reasoning were not always what I wanted to hear and the reality that justice is non existant in many ways made me feel like I was going to fail everytime I responded to a letter, put a form in or stood before authority did not stop me from trying to mediate at every point I could. Mediation is impossible if the other person does not want to mediate, but lets face it she got what she wanted in the end and I settled for what I considerd the least I would settle for.

It's kinda like a priceless situation.

Marriage Debt $ *****.00
My cost for 50/50 acceptance of debt.
Debt cleared through poverty ( no cost ) $*****.00
Affordable mortgage same as rent reconstitution of combined debt under $*****.00
Cost to me for Lawyers $25.00
Cost to X for Lawyers upwards of $40000.00

A secure enviroment filled with love and wonder, a place that will be home for my daughter that no-one can take from us.

Absoloutley Pricelesssssssss

Trust me when I tell you that I have not done this hard compared to so many out there, I have had some good breaks and have been able to work things to my favor along the way, many of you have it real hard and are doing it virtualy alone the only thing I can suggest to help is to write and share, your problems will still be there but it sure has helped me having feed back and support from all on the forum ( weather I liked it or not ) the advice and coments are themself priceless let alone the feeling that others care.

I'll post again when it all comes through and I will be as free as I ever will be from my daughters mother after this there will only be a symbiotice relationship of business proportions as necessary for my girls best interest

And we are still here for you D4E through thick and thicker until the rightoutcome reaches its peak, and then it is all downhill from there. Yet you have done it tough,..... the joinney up the mountain of paperwork and incoming seemingly colourless ...relentless mail , is well documented in your knowledge you have shared from the very fact, you attained the knowledge via The University of Painful Experience Deploma of Dip. Ed.,that you had faith in your own ability to stick it out, for yourself second and your for your beloved daughter.,..privileged to have such a Dad ! And Dad her as well.

As well as that you have relentlessly in grand encouragement posted much of you knowledge to assist others, and I know you don't like the lime-light, this is not lime-light , it is reality, and for this we are grateful , as are all who read through your posts. And don't even think of eliminating this jesture ,.....if tempted.
As we say to all who visit from time to time, thanks for sharing. We look for further news good or not so , it will end soon I'm sure.

" Incubator".....'a heated enclosed apparartus.'..sorry D4e , you know me to have a 'dreaded' sense of humour, though it holds me together, I just happened to note your reference.

I don't give advise, I tell it how it is.

To my Buddy, take care and be adventuress." There is more light..... than tunnel , though often difficult to tell"cs

Col

Oh D4E, its not fair is it?

I just caught up with your posts re your position.... outrageous that anyone can keep spending money on lawyers fighting someone who just wants equal time for the child they made together.... it boggles my mind something cronic that someone would really continue fighting against this... One would think this would be a perfect solution for everyone!

Anyhow I wanted to say re your earlier piece about how the legal letters make you feel ill. My Hubby went through exactly the same thing, and it is very much a sickness, like eating rotten food, the reaction on the body.

Rap it up with a truck load of stress, and you can see how it "breaks" people before a solution best for the Child is found.... sometimes I am sure its designed to murder the recipient.
I know Hubby reached his breaking point by year 2 of the legal fight, he eventually showed me the tree he aimed for some months earlier, and thank whoever, but he pulled back onto the road before getting to that tree.

He too walked away from the property settlement, they went from having 3 homes, investment policies and savings, to having none.

All gone, mortgages when tenants abandoned property because her "friends" told them she would be moving in, and nearly $30,000 she spent going back to court over and over..... where is the benefit to the Child now?

He could have been raised in a family home, she was certainly offered one at the beginning with savings retained, but no, it had to fight until the solicitors had drained the pot. It came down to a balance of $14K and you know, Hubby wasn't about to argue over such a rediculous amount. He told the Judge he just wanted to get "away" from her, and the Judge agreed it best too.

I still don't think its about the settlement or the money though. Its ammunition without the need for a gun. The legal system does the firing, and you do the dancing trying to keep up with the tune...

You would think there has to be a better way by now! Good luck.

That Little Person needs you as her rock in her life.

Thank you both for ur kind words and encouragement,

You are right 2ndfamily, the whole thing could have been easier and cheaper, one of the things that increased conflict was that it was not her money she has been spending. Even though she has not had legal aid for quite sometime it has been the money recieved from the single parents or from the boyfriend.
It's nice to have priorities, it has all been because she has not wanted to acknowladge her responsibility. I just don't understand someone who have this attitude, there was a time when her funds run out and at this point she was willing to negotiate but as soon as she had any money again she used it to fight, even now with lawyer number two it's cost her a bundle, but for her i think she believes that if she doesn't have to pay then her perception of reality is safe and no-one can be exposed to the truth of the situation. Well it's obviously more important to her than me and her victory that she percieves is hollow and she is welcome to it.
I'm secure that I have done the right thing for my daughter and this is a victory worth celebrating in saying this I am also aware that this may not be the last fight.

I still hold the hope that the system now works towards reducing conflict by fair mediation and not the bully tactics they have used so far and that lawyers who encourage conflict are deterd by the full system and not just judges.

It may well be fairy land at the mo but in the future who knows.

One of the things I thought of during Hubby's legal battles, (although we felt he was represented fairly and honestly) is that the law needs to "cap" how much and how far the legal representatives take a fight.

I think Solicitors and Barristers should not be able to be involved until all avenues of mediation and documentated negotiation have been exhausted.

In Hubby's case, they had already reached a settlement of who was getting what, then she was encouraged to see a well advertised legal agency, where she did not disclose her full assets, and they encouraged her to seek more for settlement.
Only down the track when Hubby's solicitor pointed out the assets list was not inclusive of her assets, did they become aware "there was more to the story".

Now in saying this, obviously some are not even going to want to go down this path, such is their anger. But somehow, if everything is documented prior to the Family Court and solicitors becoming involved, then its an open book for the Judges etc to see what is going on, and who is trying to be fair or not....

However this is a really big ask, and initially those who are "hosting" mediation still seem to me (going on some of the recent posts here) to need a really great kick in the pants for their one sided attitudes.

The system needs a new "political correctness" overhaul, me thinks.. its certainly NOT about the best interests of children at all!

There lies an inherant problem with society, if everyone was honest the system would work perfectly, if everyone fell into the catagory that the system deems as normal it would cover everyone.

Although the laws are solid in there meaning they can be applied differently and twisted to what an individual wants them to mean, if the chairperson, mediator, judge,magistrate or lawyer uses them to achieve an undetermand goal that is not in the best interest of the child as percieved by one of the parents then it's up to them to fight for the perceived meaning of the laws in regards to their situation.

Nothing gets taken into considerstion until it is raised in any of the forums you may attend on your way to secure the kids life, and even if it is acknowladged it will be dismissed if the powers that be feel it has no bearing. And when you speak about declarations and affridavits they have no meaning till your in court and they are produced, then you have to be knowladgable about any discrepencies before you can question them, ergo family has umpteen thousand dollars in debt, X wins lotto lets say million pluss, she can afford to pay her share of debt but chooses to fight it. What a tool to get what she wants, unlimited resources from an undeclared fund.

Honest people alway's come off second best because they have morals and a sense of justice, unfortunatly this just adds to their own problems because they believe in the people in moral positions will act as they would.

It shouldn't matter weather there are lawyers involved or not, they are only suppose to be there to interject on legal perceptions not representation, the problem itself lies squarely on the shoulders of the mediator to control the lawyers and if neccessary expell them from mediation if it is percieved they are influencing the negotiations.

This is not done, when going through mediation personally, I read the information of what the principals were and when the mediator allowed the X's lawyer to inject and control the mediation I asked my lawyer why he was allowing this to happen and he had not interjected to stop this, his reply was I am only there to give legal advice not take part I'm fallowing the rules. I asked the mediator why this was happening to which she replied " You could have had your lawyer do the same " My protest to this stating the principals of mediation was ignored and we were told to continue.

It wasn't mediation it was simply an atempt to destroy any thoughts I had of more time than every second weekend and half the school holidays.

Imagine how my heart sank when I like yourself read that recent post that was very simlar to my experiance three and a half years ago.

The best part is some of these mediations are closed to any screwtany and yes they do screw the fathers.

( don't get me started )

The only way to fight this is to educate the people before they attend and hope they have the strength to stand against the beast.

All the best 2ndfamily, even on the other side it is difficult to watch and not get angry.

Yes I see your point very much, so frustrating and yet so unnecessary....

Keep yer chin up D4E, you have done marvels even to get to where you are today for the sake of seeing your Girl.

Education from the start is the key. Not the thet there are ever any winners in family breakdown.

I encounter quite a number of solicitors. Usually the ones who complain about Men's Groups are trying to pull a shifty. Much harder to get away with when Dad (or Mum) has some support.

On Friday I was in court with a Dad. The Mother's solicitor was looking for ex-parte orders. Our presence in court brought to light a few points the solicitor had neglected to mention when seeking the very urgent hearing. The look the Federal magistate gave the solicitor would have frozen a volcano.

mum walked out with some of she asked for and dad walked out with orders protecting his interests as well.

A good result that I have no doubt was well fought through your assistance Oneadad.

Education and familiarisation with the system and knowing where to draw lines helps immensley. The fact that you attended gave an opportunity, the DID you are supporting is very fortunate indeed to have you on his side.

But it would be a hell of a lot better if mediation was simply started at 50/50 then negotiated backwards. Once equal footing is achieved and control removed from both parties I would suggest this itself would be enough for many to appreciate their time with their children rather than think they are controling the father by portioning out their childrens contact with them.

Imagine how lawyers would change their directive if the judge stated " This will begin at 50/50 contact, if no agreement is made otherwise it will remain so ". Some might say that accusations may increase and they may but if you make lawyers responsible for misinforming the court and the person who falsly accused responsible for their actions through variouse methods then it will also reduce false accusations.

We should walk out of a breakdown as what we went into a marriage, equals with equal rights.

Many of the people that express their situation tend to have a few different things in common and one is that the resident parent will spend enormouse amount of funds to fight the non-resident parent, they fight for control while the non-residential is usually fighting for contact and depending on the individual they may walk away with nothing instead of hundreds of thousands of dollars that could have been used to secure the future of their children and while they do this they actively brainwash the kids by all manner of abuse and alienation, some subtle some obviouse.

Realisticaly every parent should be able to walk into the court as an equal and with pride rather than a diminished beggar with a cup desperatly hoping a morsal of their childs life is dropped into their cup as they skulk away bowing with thankfulness.

Although I am one of the very lucky ones who has 50/50 contact and who has landed well and truely on his feet, the game was still played and I still followed the rules and processes, during this time and up to the directional hearing it was a constant barrage of put downs and abuse, most people concerned with the journey official lied or misinformed me and this included my own lawyer, all tried to force me into making the every second weekend and half the school holidays deal, and if I did not have the support network arround me by yourself and others on the forum to educate me and send me to find things out for myself I would have taken the deal several times over.

Point is not all are lucky enough to have that support.

How do we get the education out there to the fathers and mothers that they are parents and children are not possesions but their wards that are created with love and their lives should be cherished not used as a weapon of choice ????

Another "bargaining chip" that gets used is the equity in the family home.

In my opinion, I believe property settlement should also start at a 50/50 basis and anything in excess of that, for one party usually the residental parent on basis of providing shelter for the children, should have to be placed into a Trust ownership so it remains "for the benefit of the children" and that portion cannot be traded/sold without formal consent of all parties.

Yep

It's seem strange that due to single parent pension pluss maintinance that the " sole parent " also gets more property as well as everything else, then has all the discounts as well. then the other parent has to find enough money to pay rent on a three bedroom house close enough to see their kids.

Many are promised extra time for the privalage then denied it after it's home and hosed.

That sucks

This is also what I don't understand. I will use our example:

Apart from the settlement issue which I have outlined elsewhere, Payee earned for the last 7 financial years, more than what Hubby and I earn put together, and she still doesn't work full time.... she can earn at least 1/3 more again if she worked regular hours.

Why aren't Payees assessed on "capacity to earn" too?

MBF our health fund, offers "single parent households" a discount on private health membership, so immediately she is getting her family cover cheaper than us.

She is also entitled to both parts family allowance, because of being a "single parent household", and (last we heard) was obtaining rental assistance as well. No one assists/supplements us with our mortgage payments.

Hubby is expected to pay, and does, CS for a child he had no idea she was planning on conceiving.

Now this statement may annoy some, so be it, but when you have been in a relationship for 6 years and certain methods of contraception have been practised and decided, One expects that if and when the relationship becomes extremely rocky, that the other party isn't going to solve the problems by stopping her method of birth control, nor attempting suicide ....to resolve the situation. (Sorry I am going OT but I am just so angry at it all).

So at some point the new "laws" from next year are supposed to make it fairer for the 2nd family......

So far from what I have read, nothing is going to improve our finances, Hubby is still bordering on returning to light duties, no extra family assistance for us, rather Hubby will be paying more for the other Child.

In the meanwhile, CS lets Payee off with $17,000 lump sum payment last year "because its a once off" so Payee lives off of that, and reduces her income (and working hours) for this last financial year return.

And then we receive the CS email on Saturday telling us they intend to review Payer incomes in case of anyone earning "cash income" in the building industry and avoiding declaring their true income.....

Seems all one sided to me!

This will tickle you SF,

I reciecieved a re-assement from the C$A, explaining a change in circumstance so I rang and said there was a few things wrong.

X was director last year and eldest was working full time said non of this showed in assesment as it stated she was on pension.

They ask what proof so I told them I had none except she is still doing things for the company and driving company car and her daughter worked full time.

The response was " We can't go by hear-say "

I played the " Oh yeah it'd be different if I was female "

As usual the people who rip the system off are encouraged to do so.

the fiancee has moved out and the business has changed locations, they are still getting married but what better way to save the money.

Company gets put in third parties name, he works for the company, she goes on the pension, neither one pays support of any kind and all the cash gets hidden away.

" we can only act if you have proof " unless your female.

This would benefit me zero if they were investigated but it pissses me off they can rip off the system and get shelterd doing it.

And you can bet she will be the victim as far as everyone around is concerned, trogladitic white trash.

Had my bitch now and feel better and this is where I'll leave it because if the system is stupid enough to support shit .like this then it deserves to be ripped.